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Post by Washington GM (Blaine) on Oct 3, 2019 7:25:59 GMT -5
Hello fellow DOT members,
Due to the recent trade controversy, I felt I could throw an idea out for trade voting. I have been thinking about this for a while and have tried to find flaws but I thought I could see what other DOT members think about it.
So here goes......
When a trade gets posted and the DOT members begin to cast their vote, we have about 5 questions. The questions would be trade related obviously. Questions like, Does the trade reflect the direction of all teams involved? Is the trade detrimental to the league? Is the value comparable? Stuff like this, then there would be a point system. Each question would have a 1-5 the DOT members score their answer. 1 is very low 5 is very high, so for a fair value if you believe its close maybe you score it a 4 if it is low then you score it a 1 or 2. Then the points get added up and that decides if the trade is vetoed or not. We would have a point limit like 10, if the trade gets less than 10 points its automatically vetoed.
One major question I have with this is could we make it anonymous? would we post everyones score in the trade thread?
I am not sure if it would work or not but I thought it had potential to be a more balanced voting system and it could take out the "personal" element of voting. If you had questions to answer about the trade you would focus on those and I think it would be a more valid vote.
I just thought I would throw out an idea in the beginning stages and see what people thought.
Thanks for reading,
Blaine
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Post by Titans GM (Ricky) on Mar 12, 2021 3:33:45 GMT -5
We may need to consider revisiting the talks of how DOT goes about trade voting. I like the idea Blaine has here of a check list of sorts.
Giving each DOT member a general starting point on votes may be more beneficial for the balance of trades which would help the overall health of the league. It also could help GM's know what criteria is being looked at when offering or accepting trades ahead of time.
There isn't a perfect sceince to it. Still going to be some personal element to voting. Always will be. All in all not sure how much of a difference a check list would make since DOT members should maybe be doing that anyways(myself included).
It may be worth considering a open discussion to see if anyone else has ideas on how to approach the trade voting process. Not that our current system is necessarily broken much as maybe someone can think of a different or improved way to go about it like Blaine did here.
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Post by Broncos GM (Kevin) on Mar 12, 2021 7:15:38 GMT -5
There was a recent trade controversy?
There's so many moving parts in evaluating trades
Salary
Year's left
Previous seasons output v anticipated next season output (I use the latter but other go by the former)
player talent v opportunity
long term prospects v short term gain
Usable depth already on roster or roster need if you will
The owners own view of talent has to be respected too
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Post by Titans GM (Ricky) on Mar 12, 2021 16:07:59 GMT -5
There was a trade controversy back in the day which this tread was created for. I just piggy backed on Blaine's original post about having ideas of how to approach the trade voting.
I agree with the things you mentioned for viewing trades. And I completely agree GM's view on talent should also be accounted for.
In a sense those same points can be made for any trade so if that's the case no trade should ever be vetoed.
Im tryin to understand what would make the value argument valid for some trades to be vetoed but not mentioned on others. If it's just wild west for DOT members then why even have them voting on trades.
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Post by Panthers GM (Jesse) on Mar 12, 2021 18:03:43 GMT -5
There was a trade controversy back in the day which this tread was created for. I just piggy backed on Blaine's original post about having ideas of how to approach the trade voting. I agree with the things you mentioned for viewing trades. And I completely agree GM's view on talent should also be accounted for. In a sense those same points can be made for any trade so if that's the case no trade should ever be vetoed. Im tryin to understand what would make the value argument valid for some trades to be vetoed but not mentioned on others. If it's just wild west for DOT members then why even have them voting on trades. I'm not a fan of vetoing at all. Veto should be considered 1. When a new team is making a huge trade that TAB members, who understand league value, deem a big mistake 2. When a trade is so bad it shifts the balance of the league in a way that could reasonably be considered a sign of collusion No way a trade involving 2 DEs and a future 2nd should be vetoed unless one side is giving JJ Watt and the 2nd and the other side's DE isn't in the league anymore. If I firmly believe Juwan Johnson is a future top 5 WR and the only way you'd trade him is for a 1st round pick and I agree to it, I should be allowed to make that bet. |
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Post by Broncos GM (Kevin) on Mar 12, 2021 18:08:22 GMT -5
Yes the Clarke trade was fine and should never have been vetoed.. Again two very good GM's who know what they're doing.
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Post by Bills GM (Anthony) on Mar 12, 2021 18:34:26 GMT -5
Inconsistency in voting will always be there.
TAB is inconsistent with their voting, I am too.
I don’t think theres a way around that though, just nature of the beast
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Post by Bills GM (Anthony) on Mar 12, 2021 18:41:23 GMT -5
I think a system that Blaine mentioned several years ago could be the way to go.
Where to pass a trade talks 3 votes
And to veto a trade takes 4 Or 5 will help
I feel that as soon as that first veto comes in, then all of our views of a trade can become affected. We then think extra critically and try and find ways to veto a trade, instead of finding ways to approve, because we dont want to be different or be viewed as out of touch on values....this is human nature....nothing much we can do about this. It happens. I know I’ve done this too.
vetoable trades should in my opinion always be 3-0.
A 3-2 veto, is tough...based on the rules of TAB “detrimental to the league”...thinking that standard, tough to have a close vote. In my opinion of course. Detrimental to the league shouldn’t be a toss up issue. Gotta be 3-0. Anything short of that, should pass.
Maybe needing more vetoes votes to crush a trade makes sense, and allows for more independent thinking....just idea
I also dont think voting is a huge issue at all in this league or any other.
Everyone does there best. And that is all we can ask for.
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Post by BuccaneersGM (Greg) on Mar 12, 2021 21:26:18 GMT -5
I was one of the vetoers on the Clark trade. I usually do not veto, but in this case I felt the trade was just too lopsided in favor of the Giants. Highsmith is a rising young star LB on a very good PIT defense. Plus he's on a great long term deal. Highsmith plus a 2nd is just too much for Clark.
I don't think the current voting system is broken. In fact in this league it's better than most because we have some very seasoned TAB members. We may all disagree on the evaluation of some of the trades, but honestly very few trades are vetoed.
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Post by Bills GM (Anthony) on Mar 12, 2021 22:42:10 GMT -5
Just for the record....,me chiming in had zero to do with my trade or the vetoed bills/Steelers trade
Vetoes happen, a part of the game....no issue at all
Just decided to chime in on the thread that was active and going
Greg is right , TAB is great always has been....tons of knowledge.
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Post by Titans GM (Ricky) on Mar 13, 2021 20:21:32 GMT -5
Thanks everyone for your input on how you go about voting on trades is much appreciated. I just wanted to say a few things on the matter. I'll move on from the trade voting idea discussion to not create anymore unnecessary distraction.
My intention wasn't to question DOT's ability to vote on trades. If look at my original post I mentioned the system isn't necessarily broken but maybe someone can come up with an improved way to go about it. I still stand by that statement. Not at all trying to have that come out as an attack on DOT or their experience or trustworthiness.
Since I've joined the league the majority of things have grown and evolved. So I'm questioning why the trade voting process hasn't. Doesn't mean I expect a instant change to take place or even a change at all. Maybe there is no better way so that's why it hasn't changed.
I feel it's pretty clear that each DOT member is viewing the voting process by different standards. Which has its pros and cons just like having some type of a voting system check list to follow would. I do think it's fair to see how DOT is seeing the trades they vote on. To my understanding this has never been discussed by DOT members until recently saying we got the experience.
Having those discussions will help me get a better overall view of how to be better at voting on trades. Could also help GM's understand how their trades are being looked at from DOT ahead of time.
My intentions for bringing up the trade voting process wasn't to come off like it's being done wrong. I just think it has the ability to be improved by questioning how the process is done by the DOT team.
Understandable aren't many vetos in this league. I'm viewing this topic more as of a way to communicate improved ways of possibly going about trade voting process. Not trying to say the amount of vetos or lack thereof is an issue.
Anyways the biggest thing I wanted to get out there is me brining up trade voting process isn't a lack of faith in the DOT members. Voting on trades is never easy. Which is why I was tryin to help figure out ways to get more understanding of the process each members uses for trade votes. To maybe help with some of those tough calls.
If everyone feels like it ain't broke don't fix it I get it no complaints here. I appreciate everyone taking the time to reply and taking the time to read my thoughts.
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